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Minimum Wage


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#17 Insathius

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:49 pm

there would be no labour shortage for people as the proffit would go back into company /shareholders dividend and would provent directors/execs asset stripping a company.for there own gain .


If the reverse was happening, i.e profits going directly to directors/exec's then why would someone work for a company like that? and how could they stay competitive if they were not investing in their products/services?
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#18 mixe

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 01:01 pm

if you are needing more hrs labour then you employ ppl and expand and if your profit stays flat then you should'nt of expanded in the 1st place lowering wages of ppl to maintan profit is just bad management

Edited by mixe, 03 May 2012 - 10:00 pm.

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#19 CorkLike

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 01:06 pm

i live in ireland and i am unemployed. i recieve 188.00 per week from the government as well as free medication, doctor and hospital visits, dentistry, and an allowance of 16.50 per week towards my rent. if the minimum wage were removed here, a working person could get less wages in a week than i get for not working, then people would choose to be unemployed as a lifestyle choice... you would be less well off by working as opposed to not working
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#20 mixe

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 01:14 pm

thay do what they are doing now going to gov for bail outs going under begging share holders for more investment getting labour less skillled from cheap countries to name a few

Edited by mixe, 03 May 2012 - 10:01 pm.

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#21 Darkademic

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 01:30 pm

Ordinary people do not benefit from the minimum wage, they suffer from it, it's just the costs are hidden.

To compensate for the loss of profits, compaines raise the prices of their goods and services (an effect made worse by inflation), employ fewer people, and give fewer or smaller bonuses/payrises.

Let's assume a company has 10 minimum-wage workers for an total hourly cost of £60.80 (£6.08 × 10). If the minimum wage is raised another £0.70, that would raise the company's labour costs to £67.80 per hour. The problem is that, all things equal, the budget only allows for £60.80/hour. The easiest thing to do in this situation is to reduce the number of people employed to 9, which would put the total hourly cost at £54.72 (£6.08 × 9), under the allotted amount of £60.80. This is not to say that increasing the minimum wage will automatically lead to increased unemployment. What it does do, however, is add one more strain on businesses.

Another effect of the minimum wage is to reduce the availability of on-the-job training, since more resources are required simply to hire and retain a workforce. Far from increasing opportunities for the working poor, a minimum wage actually restricts their mobility.

Yet another effect is that firms faced with minimum wage laws often substitute skilled for unskilled labor. In a report for the Show-Me Institute, labour economist David Neumark offers an illustrative example: Suppose that a job can be done by either three unskilled workers or two skilled workers. If the unskilled wage is £5 per hour and the skilled wage is £8 per hour, the firm will use unskilled labor and produce the output at a cost of £15. However, if we impose a minimum wage to £6 per hour, the firm will instead use two skilled workers and produce for £16 as opposed to the £18 cost of using unskilled workers. In the "official data" this shows up as a small job loss — in this case, only one job — but we see an increase in average wages to eight pounds per hour in spite of the fact that the least skilled workers are now unemployed.

If a lack of incentive to work due to generous benefits is a concern, the solution is to lower benefits (and ultimately I would support getting rid of them altogether).

Advocates of higher minimum wages are often motivated by the purest of concerns for the poor. However, the minimum wage has been described as a "maximum folly" by many economists for many years because it hurts precisely the people who most desperately need help.
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#22 mixe

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 01:46 pm

agree min wage is too high ppl who dig holes got a pay rise while semi skilled ppl like secretaries got a pay freeze/cut however if you want to solve poverty you 1st need to look at greed and that's why i think a max wage is the way to go

Edited by mixe, 03 May 2012 - 10:02 pm.

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#23 Darkademic

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 01:51 pm

If you add a maximum wage, all the high earners will just leave the country.
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#24 mixe

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 01:55 pm

lol its an empty thret thay would still be at the top of food chain as far as wage scale+theres 60mill of us in uk and we runnin outa water so let em leave
do yo think being sucsseful buisnes man is more important than a high court judg or primeminister i think all these to jobs should be paid equaly or there abouts when you have someone sitting on billions tho and the top erners in scosiaty are on 100x less then u have probs with corruption

Edited by mixe, 03 May 2012 - 02:20 pm.

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#25 CorkLike

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 05:53 pm

if a company can pay its employee's less and make more profit, that's not to say theyl pass on any of this profit... im actually studying these kinds of issues, but it seems like its kind of a touchy subject so im leaving it alone :D
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#26 Prophet

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 11:43 am

While I am eager to learn, I can't claim to know much about economics.
I can, however, understand what has been said, and I now have a much better idea about how a minimum wage affects more than the government would have us believe.

From personal experience, I feel that the minimum wage has actually stopped me from earning more.

As an under-18 apprentice here in the UK, I earn £2.60 an hour (minimum wage). I do honestly believe that I would earn more if the minimum wage was scrapped. I wouldn't say that it encourages employers to pay terribly low rates, but it definitely gives them an excuse to. From their point of view, because the goverment has said, "This is the lowest you can pay your apprentices", that means that it's acceptable.

I am almost certain that my employer would pay me more if there was no minimum wage.
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#27 mixe

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 09:47 pm

thay would pay you less 12 yr ago an apprentice would get £50 per week now adays my labours complane about £50 per day !!

Edited by mixe, 09 May 2012 - 10:39 pm.

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#28 Darkademic

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 11:22 pm


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#29 Prophet

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:33 am

thay would pay you less 12 yr ago an apprentice would get £50 per week


Source?
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#30 Rylanor

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 11:32 am

I wish that a maximum wage would work, as the amount some people are paid is one of the most obscene things in this world. Also the far lower wage for under 21s, for whom everything costs just the same. I find it disgusting that so many are paid so little and that there's such a difference between what certain jobs pay compared to others, but then I'm an idealist :/
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#31 CCN

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 11:39 am

Source?

If you're willing to work for £2.60 why would they ever pay you more?
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#32 MuteClown

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 03:48 pm

Firstly i would like to address this "flawed marx ecnomic premise", since the fact marx was against all forms wages, so to say that marx's theories had a play in minimum wage is a flat out lie. Marx often made the point to show that wages is the value of the labour the worker provides the employer, but if the worker works harder to try and benifit his standing and earn more, he in fact devalues his labour, since he will be payed the same ammount no matter; and thus never advance his situation.

that's not even to mention the issues Marx pointed out with the fact that the worker is forced to sell his labour, based on material forces which is instigated by the private ownership of means of production.

Since minimum wage is far from a living wage, the thought that we are even debating the removal of it brings into question the whole basis of capitalism. In London the living wage is £8.30, yet our national minimum wage is i think £6.08 for anyone aged 21+.
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